Eight men have been charged with soliciting and performing sex acts in restrooms and on trails at Gambrill State Park.

Story at 8 charged in Gambrill State Park sex act sting - wtop.com

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Be careful. Just don't do anything in a public park.

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anti gay. if straight people were doing it the cops would look the other way.

But in all fairness some gay guys have no discretion at all.

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Overly aggressive sexual behavior in public is dangerous. While I see the cops' view of promoting public decency, I also agree that a heterosexual couple in the same situation would fare far better. Of course, a lone woman offering a cop a blow job or more without a monetary consideration would be amply rewarded with a good time and a load of cum.

Between the gay bars and ABS and online hookups, the days of outdoors cruising are numbered. People need to adapt.

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As much as I respect your opinions, can I just say this statement is ridiculous? As long as there are people who prefer being outdoors to a stuffy smoke-filled room, there will be outdoor sex. As long as there are people who don't have the spare cash to afford the ABS, there will be outdoor sex. As long as there are people having sex, they'll be outdoor sex. As long as there is an outdoors, there will be sex outdoors. This is the way it has been since the beginning of time.

Who needs to adapt are the cops. And the laws they enforce. And the politicians who write the laws. And the citizens who elect the politicians. They all need to adapt, but not in the direction you suggest.

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While that is easy to say, it is not going to happen. There will be no public protests against police crackdowns on cruising and gay suppression laws. The politicians will lie to the general public that these are necessary to protect the "quality of life" in their community. Nobody is going to stand up in a public meeting and argue that gays have the right to seek each other out in public places.

If you want to cruise in the great outdoors, you need to recognize the risks and be prepared for the consequences, however unjust.

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I have personally stood up in public meetings and argued that what people do behind bushes is no one else's business. My strategy is simple: to demand that if the law is to remain on the books and enforced, it must be enforced equally. Demand to see the records of arrests in your community and you'll soon see the pattern: the vast majority of those arrested are same sex encounters. Then you threaten the local town with a lawsuit, and demand they prove that the law is applied equally. It never is.

Straight people consider public sex a rite of passage, a way to spice up a marriage, a casual way to get off in the midst of passion. Gay men are treated literally like sexual predators and put on sex offender lists because they engage in the same behavior. It is not right. It must be challenged.

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Cruisers DO stand up. In China.

Gay Chinese stand up to police sweep of hangout

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I previously read the news article on the China Stand-Up to Authority, and was impressed by it. You raised interesting points in your previous response, and even provided a reasonable means of getting some action.

Yet, I still stand by my assertion that there will be no wide-spread change in public attitude (outside of the gay community) regarding gay public sex. I don't dispute your assertions that there is a double standard, and this is just one more injustice against the gay community.

What I dispute is that, in the US, there are enough people willing to stand up as you do to protest this in order to effect change. They will march in mass where they can blend in with the crowd, or tell friends "I was just there to support a gay friend." Don't count on them to come out of the bushes in public.

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Had you told me I'd be able to marry another man in Iowa even 2 years ago I would have laughed at you. Anything can happen. We just have to have enough vision and stop being so damn negative, so certain things will always be "this way".

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Keith and Grumpy,

Both of you are right about attitudes and conduct...but it isn't an either-or situation.

Yes, politicos and law enforcement need to be given a clear and concise attitude adjustment and leave same-sex play that is not otherwise disturbing the peace alone.

However...

My observations of the last thirty-some-odd years strongly indicates an attitude adjustment of at least equal, if not greater, proportions needs to be delivered to a large majority of same-sex players.

Way, way back before the 1980s, it was a universal given that if you were caught by law enforcement engaging in homosexual activity, you were almost certainly going to be busted, humiliated, and have your life ruined. Men went to great lengths to exercise the utmost discretion and protect places they could get action. There was a strict, unspoken gentleman's code of conduct that all followed. Among this was common sense stuff like not making a mess, not getting in other guys' ways, and not doing anything to attract curiosity or suspicion to the place.

By the late 1970s, this began to erode as homosexuality became "fashionable" during the post-Stonewall sexual revolution. More and more men became emboldened about their activities. However, this ran smack into the brick wall of the Moral Majority and the rest of the conservative/moralistic resurgence of the mid-1980s. The prudes and homophobes managed to overwhelm the more liberal communities around them and sent homosexual freedom from harassment back to the early 1960s in many places...including such iconic places as NYC and San Francisco. They co-opted the AIDS epidemic as the vehicle to "protect the public from harm" by disrupting the ability to easily obtain anonymous sex.

[Sidebar: Contrary to popular belief, California is far from being the bastion of liberal daylight many think it is. Once you leave the San Francisco or Los Angeles city/county limits, the Out and Proud Man could easily think he's somewhere in the Deep South. California has one huge-ass block of conservative, right-wingers, as the whole Prop.8 mess proved.]

The in-your-face attitude of "fuck civility and respecting anyone else" that came into vogue with Gen X in the 1990s made things even worse. The vast majority of guys who came onto the scene since the 90s have practically zero knowledge of what it was like for gays, and disdain and contempt for things like the etiquette and courtesy our older generations lived by. There is a huge difference between "sex in public places" and "sex in everyone's face." If there's a great spot along a path in a park, don't stand there stroking your dick when there are families around, and for God's sake, don't leave the damn place littered with used rubbers or other consumables...learn how to use a fucking wastebasket! (As a father and someone active in my community, I would absolutely be calling the cops or complaining to my civic leaders about shit like that.)

This also means they lack the abilities to comprehend their conduct is what's creating problems in the first place and, more importantly, if they don't like the status quo it is entirely encumbent upon them to get off their asses and advocate for change like their predecessors did. Instead, they bitch about things on the net and get exceedingly hostile to anyone who tells them to be considerate or participate in the legislative process to abolish stupid, archaic, repressive laws. (There is also a good number of 40- and 50-somethings who act that way but they're coming more from a point of "we already did this shit...it's someone else's turn to fight this battle.")

The solution lies with "the rest of us" fostering a return to civility and re-establishing the "rules of the road" by promoting good behavior in public, and encourage those on the sidelines to stop being a bunch of lazy-ass whiners and strike back with actions like voting-out asshole politicians whose social mindsets are stuck in the McCarthy era.

One logical place to start is sites like CFS prominently posting some etiquette rules, followed by the "heads-ups" alerts. Make guys at least have to click-through that to get to the good stuff. And, since this is the Internet, reach out to HRC and local advocacy groups to create an awareness campaign that bombards these throwback localities with negative publicity and shame about their outdated, homophobic policies. Put them on the defensive for a change, instead of men just wanting a little release.

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I have a need for seed!

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Excellent thoughts and suggestions. Hope people read this.

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Civility is lost for many people in many situations, including men who cruise for sex in public places. It is one of the more sad developments of our lives and only those of us of a certain age are aware of it since we know the way things once were. But less we glamorize it too much, the way it once was included men cowering in fire-trap bars in the underground sections of a handful of cities, owners paying off the cops to look the other way, and any and everyone subject to blackmail. The times were good and the times were bad. I do not want to go back to 'the good old days'. I do confess, however, that Mad Men really does make the '60's look cool!

What I do want is for the law to be applied equally. I'd also like to see the laws used against cruisers repealed, but perhaps the strategy to get to that point is to demand that existing law be applied equally. After all, it is not a small development that for the largest populations of gays in the USA today, we are increasingly equal with the same rights and obligations. So if they're going to continue arresting gay men for even going into a cruisy park, they damn well better do it for the straights that go into the same park. If they're going to arrest gay guys for doing it in the bushes, then we must insist they arrest straights at Lovers' Lanes all across the land.

If it is bad for me to suck a dick in a darkened corner of a park, it is bad for a guy to fuck a girl in the same darkened corner of a park. On the other hand, we could come to a more rational understanding of human behavior and understand that sex does not always happen behind closed doors in a bed in the missionary position.

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I don't totally disagree with Keith, but realize what should be and what is are two different matters. It's not just Law Enforcement either. If a man and woman were cuddling and kissing in the Food Court of the Mall, the most likely reaction from passing people would be a smile (awww, ain't that sweet) or a snicker (get a room). Try the same setting with two guys kissing, and the reaction would be entirely different. People would register a look of disgust on their face, and even complain to the Mall office to send security to "clean up the Food Court".

Even people who publicly admit "some of my best friends are gay" are uncomfortable when presented with actual gay sexual expression. If you and your significant other were spending an overnight at a straight friend's house, expect different treatment. If it is a heterosexual couple, the friend probably wouldn't mind and might even give you the high sign for success (maybe just the male host). Try that with two guys wanting to sleep together on an overnight, and there will be an uncomfortable resistance even if not voiced.

We can continue to work toward equal respect for gays to go with equal rights, but it is a tougher battle to win. My point is that cruisers must realize this and the risks involved.

It would be great to be the test case for equal treatment under the law for gay cruising vs straight cruising, but I'm too much of a chicken to be the one at my age. I also suspect that the cops would claim they enforce the law equally when the truth is they only try to curtail heterosexual prostitution.

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Charges: Assault Second Degree and Sex Offense Fourth Degree for making sexual contact (grabbing) with an undercover officer.
I may be off base but the article implies with verses at, The Officer's must have had there ding a lings out for them to be grabbed and if the grabbing was mutual then they did some assaulting of there own,hmmmn sounds like entrapment to me but who will they believe, The officers of course.

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