I always found it interesting how some guys would "go through phases" where for a period - sometimes it was a one time thing - with others maybe you fooled around all summer - then you meet up with them again down the road and they had - or at least said they had no interest.

One friend who lived next door LOVED it - if anything he was too into it and I would often be telling him to "cool it" or someone would figure out. Then his parents got divorced and they moved away. I saw him the next summer and it was like nothing had ever happened. He was clearly embarrassed to see me and wanted nothing to do with our past activities and pretended they had never happened.

And a few of them "found god" and suddenly they knew it was "wrong" and not only did they stop but everyone else should as well.

And then of course there were the "alcohol gays" - they were totally straight - but if they had to much to drink would be the horniest cocksucker you ever met. I always figured that most of them were just in such denial they needed to be drunk as an "excuse".

I have always believed that everyone is bi to some degree - some are more gay - some are more straight - only society and the rules of society make us feel that fooling around with other guys is "wrong".

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Strange as this may sound, my buddies and I thought that this inconsistent behavior, shifting tastes, finding new groups of people to hang out with, etc., were all 'natural'.

First off, by far, not everyone was really into this kind of play, drunk or not. Second off, life always interfered even with our best laid out plans. So, it was more or less, 'here and now' with a few people. And soon enough, we figured out who was in it for a long haul. So, those dudes became the hard core of the little private coterie which naturally, had its ups and downs, but which, on balance, worked amazingly well until we graduated/post graduated and moved on with our lives.

No one had really expected such clandestine college class DADT arrangements to outlast the college days. And they did not.

But we had a reasonably good to very good times. Sure, a few guys were willing. But you still had to do some footwork to score. You learnt to accept that not every try would always land you a win. And you learnt to shrug with your shoulders, and move on, too. More importantly, most guys understood their positions in the pecking order, and a few learnt to respect their buddies while understanding that no one was irreplaceable, and that a smart guy would never let anyone (male or female) take him by his balls and hold him a hostage.

Some decided to take their experience with them, and the others chose, as you pointed out, to go into the denial. It did not matter to most of us. We paid very little regard to any of this. It got too hot in the kitchen, so a few dudes packed up and left? Yeah, that happens.

A dude left the play? Well, he must have had his reasons. The next dude or a couple of them filled in, and the life kept on moving. Not every 'new' guy was always as good as the guy who chose to move on, but some were, and some were actually a change for the better, too.

KD

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It was always disappointing when a good sex buddy "outgrew" fooling around - but it happened a lot - especially when we were younger. Guys would be so horny they would try anything to get off - but once he started to have other outlets (usually girls) they ended it. But it was frustrating when a buddy with a great ass suddenly said he had a girlfriend now... but most of the guys moved on - only a few were or would accept they were gay.




You had to stay on your toes - young people can change very quickly - but it was frustrating when you were going to see a buddy that had been great in bed and suddenly he acted as if none of it every happened.

Sometimes there might be a comment like "I don't do that any more" other times they acted as if it never happened and you must be crazy.

I may have been crazy but damn there were some fun times!

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I really never took anything for granted. Not even after I have been topping a dude on a very regular basis. Not even when it looked like he was totally gay, and craved cock more than anything else in his life. It is always his life, and he is free to call the shots, move on, come back for more or not.

The good bit about this inherent instability was that practically all my buddies and I counted on it. We networked to no end, and were looking constantly for the 'new' guys, even when it all looked like everything was just fine, and everyone was getting his fair share of fun or more...

Once a dude 'faded away', well, he faded away. A few comments were exchanged among the guys in the know, but that was it. A new dude showed up, and the play continued.

This was a valuable lesson, though. You learnt pretty soon in your young life that sex relationships were very transient. Sure, one or the other dude suffered when his favorite mate gave up on him and moved on to girls or to other guys. But, soon enough, we all learned that this was the default in our college days. It happened to everyone, so no one felt that he was any worse off for the experience than the next guy.

Only one of my buddies came over to me to tell me that it all did not matter, that we were only horny, and that he was a str8 guy looking for girls. The rest of them just faded away.

I did not take an issue with the aforementioned dude. Both he and I knew that I was nailing him for 2 good years, at least once a week, and more often 2-3 times a week.

They say, 'what is done cannot be undone' for a reason...

KD

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In many ways for some guys growing up was sort of like the olden days of men at sea - they did not have any options but could not go for months and months with nothing.

I think a very large percentage at some point in time have SOME sort of MM experience - it may be just jacking off with a buddy - it may go on to full sex - but if everyone where honest (with themselves as well as the survey) I think we would find the number with experience is much greater than people want to admit.

Some stay with it- some do not.




I always found that a bit weird - how the brain and the cock could be so totally out of connection. There were a few guys that were hard and got off and had a great cum - but the "big head" just did not enjoy it. It mostly had to be upbringing because their dick liked it - but somehow they could not get past the idea and they did it once or twice and then it was over.






It is interesting how some were active / willing participants - even instigators - and then deny it ever happened.

But some later on come to accept and get past the guilt - even if they don't want to do it again. I was contacted by a guy I used to fool around with as a teen who found me on the internet. For years he denied anything ever happened. But now he is older and married with kids and seems to have a perspective on it. I never brought it up - but he did - it was very much a thing of the past (he was not looking to hook up now) but perfectly comfortable that we did what we did and enjoyed it.

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Now, I want to college in a major European city. Sure, scoring up with a chick was not as easy, simple and inexpensive as having your buddy give you a BJ. Scoring with a girl meant, dating, romance, time, money. Lots of time and lots of money with no guarantee that a few weeks into the process you may get some. But dating girls was far from impossible. And quite a few guys took that road, too. Some of them looked for their buddies for some little sexual support on the way, and the others stayed faithful to their heterosexual/heteronormative ideals.

I fully concur with John here that most probably, a very large number of guys must have had some sort of m2m sexual experience along the way, while at college. Now, such sexual encounters took place under the condition of total secrecy. No one was going to tell. Hence, I am not surprised that the guys are not mentioning it too often.

I can also imagine that for a number of guys, once or twice off an encounter with another dude that led to nothing in particular, whereas probably interesting, and maybe even satisfying in its time and day stayed what it really was, a once or twice off thing not worth elaborating too much on.





This was probably not just the upbringing but very much so the prevailing societal attitudes of the times. A dude shot his load or two after a hot session. What's there not to like? He may have prefered having some other hardware at play though, but the experience sure beat your usual 'solitary exploration'. At that point, a few guys started thinking that 'one thing usually leads to another'. And a few months later, you are totally hooked up to it, you are enjoying yourself, while the world is about to get ready and reject you totally for being a freak, a homo, a fag, an outcast, whatever. AND you saw your childhood dream of a happy family with kids and the white picket fence just fly out of the window...

Quite a few guys were brought up with an explicit promise of a social contract. You stay with the mainstay, you uphold the majority values, and the majority lifestyle, you shun out the freaks, and the majority will take care of you, and make sure that you'll never have to leave your comfort zone. The golden boys would take care of each other's future. You know, 'Us - The Righteous against them The Freaks'.

The promise was largely maintained in the 40's, 50's 60's and the 70's mostly for strategical reasons. But the '80s brought a landslide change. No one was going to come riding to the rescue of your sorry laid-off, mortgage-ridden, with a bunch of unpaid bills ass just because you were a willing conformist supporting the views of the moral majority.

The social contract deal in its very narrow sense was off. Conformism alone stopped paying bills.

A vast new alternative, and not only marginal world emerged on many fringes of the society, making brave forays into the mainstream.



This is a universal trait of humanity. I had one of my regular buddies tell me that he would have never had sex with me if I had not told him to. Frankly, I am not even sure that I ever formally 'told him' to have sex with me. (How many guys go around formally telling other dudes to have sex with them?) More likely, I pulled out my cock and started stroking it, and he fell down on his knees and started licking/sucking it. When I slapped him on his ass, he bent over for me to ride in.

If he really had asked me if I was telling me to have sex with me, I would have certainly told him to do so

We are all being constantly told that we should be trying to relentlessly promote our own, usually misperceived self-interest first and foremost. Any number of people are buying things that they do not need with the money that they do not have only to go through the interminable agonies of buyer's remorse at the thought that someone else may have clinched an even better a deal over the same item of dubious practical value.

Similar logic applies to some of our past experiences. See, I was nailing this buddy of mine who was just a regular next door college dude. I would have never done so if he had not asked for it, and actually, being the hunk that I was in those days, I could have scored a much hunkier, cooler dude... or at least so goes the narrative. So, actually, none of that pounding, and none of those many shoots had anything to do with me. I only did it because this other guy was willing...

With some dudes, at some point of time, the maturity kicks in, and they see that they should own it, too. They did what they did in their time and day, under the circumstances, and they see that there is no real reason for them to deny it anymore. In particular, now that being gay has become part of the mainstream, too.

KD

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I saw this and it reminded me of when I came out to my father, a retired Air Force Lt. Colonel with 32 years in the service going back to WWII. He told me it was OK and that he "knew guys" who did this from years back.

This was when he and his girlfriend (complicated, he and my mother never divorced for both pragmatic and personal reasons) visited me in DC. I took them to a gay bar/restaurant and to other essentially gay resturants, we went to Dignity's "Mass for the Gay and Lesbian Community," and if either was taken aback by anything they never said so to me.

To take this from the personal to possibly more universal, there are "worldly" men who know these things and accept them as part of life. A lot of military guys from my Dad's generation basically knew the score and, although conservative in the range from Barry Goldwater to Gerald Ford to George H.W. Bush (at least before Reagan and the Moral Majority, etc.), they were personally often more open-minded and sometimes advocated what are now considered liberal positions on social issues.

Thus, Houston's current lesbian Mayor Annise Parker, who came out and was a public activist from college onward, was still able to work for Republican Rob Mosbacher's energy company for 18 years. Although Parker, just as I am, is a Democrat and LGBTetc., she could be there and advance even while Mosbacher worked for Bush's campaigns and later entered his Cabinet and she contiunied local political activities and activism in Houston.

To me it's a shame the current political climate seems so divided and unforgiving, accentuated by social media, 24-hour-news, and more. I want to believe that more people are flexible and understanding when they get down to person-to-person interaction.

Perhaps that goes even more so for those who for whatever reason must live double lives. LGBTetc. people sometimes shame or pressure people to sort of "make a choice" or come out and essentially label themselves as something or other. I prefer to start with the person, whoever they are, wherever they feel comfortable, first. I want to listen rather than lecture and speak from my own experience rather than tell people what to do with theirs.

But that's just me, others can agree or disagree. I so far behind on work and site updates await.

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Yup. Older members of my family openly spoke about an uncle, and couple of family friends who were gay. They used the wording, 'They were into other men.'

The men in the family never really gave any negative comment about it, though the women openly expressed their disapproval behind their backs. But the very same women in the family also very much disapproved of divorce, until a few of them got divorced themselves, and stopped badmouthing it.

Yet, the general attitude was that sexuality was a private thing for every adult to decide about. None of my 'ole folks' ever envisioned the world in which you could live your life openly as a gay person. History proved them wrong.

Even so, I never experienced ostracism of anyone among the family or friends who was gay. In particular, successful people were openly admired regardless of their sexual orientation. A guy was either contributing to their wealth and social networking abilities or he was not. That mattered. His sexual life - not really.

KD

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I think everyone's family has a "bachelor uncle" or two...

And in some ways I think the rules of society both helped and hurt then. Although he was never able to be out or married no one ever talked about his sexuality or ostracized him for being gay.

There was no discussion at all about his sexual orientation - everyone knew it but they just went on about their lives.

Now the best will be when we finally reach the day that he can be open and married but it is again not a topic of conversation everyone just goes about with their lives.

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Sure, it is a progress to reduce/stop discrimination, and enjoy the benefits of marriage in terms of tax relief, health care, and other perks for the guys who choose to tie the knot.

But again, we are talking sexuality here, which remains a private, intimate matter, first and foremost. Very few people would go elaborating on it on a family reunion. I would not want them to, myself.

KD

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