(This goes back a few years. Hence, the economic struggle of the players involved does not show up!)

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I landed in Athens Friday morning, and checked into a nice hotel on one of the main avenues of Athens. Being a beginner, and this being my very second assignment, I thought, I scored pretty well with this all marble and polished brass digs and all expenses paid atop a handsome hourly fee.

I went for a jog, exploring the neighborhood. A few guys turned their heads, and some 'innocent' smiles were exchanged.

Having a weekend ahead of me, I went barhopping Friday night, hoping to score. The few bars I went into were pretty smokey, guys were mostly of a less desirable mix, and wishing to cut the chase, I opted for the gay baths in downtown Athens.

A few guys introduced themselves, at the door, as 'str8 guys' who were going to let me suck their dicks for money. Well, those dudes were knocking at the wrong door. I shrugged with my shoulders, threw my 'ehfaristou' at them, and went on to explore the other options. A foreigner in Athens usually meant some quick cash, so a small crowd of guys went after me, offering discounts

Eventually, the hustler dudes gave up, and I bumped into a cute, Greek guy, nicely ripped, with curly black hair, in his mid-20s. He flashed a few smiles, and asked me, what I was looking for.

I told him that beating around the bush was not my forte. I was there to get sucked, and fuck a cute dude, if I found one.

Judging by his reaction, he was taken aback. True, I was a foreigner there, but even I should have known that you do not play with open cards at such places.

"Dude, you asked me a direct question, so, I gave you a direct answer."

He went on to say, that he would be happy to show me some local stuff, and teach me the local ways I was obviously very ignorant about. And his name was Georgius. He mentioned his name as if he was disclosing a well-guarded secret, showing a surprising degree of solemnity about it.

Well, I thought, now that I knew Georgius, my Greek experience was going to take a turn for better. I introduced myself mimicking a degree of solemnity he applied to his introduction.

With the formalities behind us, I gave him a questioning look.

If he ever had the intention of sharing his CV with me, that plan got chucked overboard there and then. I hit the gay spa to get my rocks off, not to learn biographies. We can start being friends once we put the pressing business at hand (or at crotch) behind us.

He half-embraced me, and started whispering into my ear:

"Dude, only prostitutes, and their clients fuck here. You either have a place or you need one, if you want to tap my ass."

I could easily see his point. The few available rooms were pretty dirty, and offered little privacy. Georgius did not look like a regular there.

"Follow me, now!", I told him, and he nodded. I paid both his and my tab, and the hustler crowd started commenting amongst themselves in an agitated manner.

Couple of minutes later we were taxing to my hotel. Georgious was duly impressed with my digs, and followed me to my room.

I locked the door behind us, and started kissing him and unbuttoning his white shirt. If anything, I caught up with my young Greek god, all wiry and ripped, abs shining with a few drops of sweat on them.

He was not holding back anymore. He grabbed my cock, and went down on it. After a short sucking session, probably meant to show me that he knew his trade, he looked up at me, and asked, while holding my cock in his hand, 'So, this is what you are proposing for tonight?'

I looked around, like I was giving it a serious second thought, and said, 'Yeah, dude, that's what you have got to work on tonight."

A big smile spread around his lips. "Wow, I like them big and heavy!", he said.

By that time, he must have caught my drift. I was not into wasting anyone's time. Let's fuck now, and do the rest later...

I threw a bottle of lube at him. I ripped a condom open, and indicated that I was good and ready to go.

He screamed into the pillow a few times, and took my invasion like a champ. The guy was very tight, and though I was taking my time, breaking him in, had to be painful.

Once he adjusted, the fun and games started, he kept on asking me not to pull it out (I never had any intention of doing so), but used this to tease him a bit. He figured my game out, and was pushing back with all he had.

Well, if I was horny, he was both horny and sexually starved. Whenever I started to slow down the action, he started begging me not to stop.

"Dude, fuck me with all you have got!" I had no intention of holding back.

I shot my load inside the condom, while fucking him doggie style, changed the condom and fucked him in missionary position to shoot again. We ended with him hugging the back of the armchair, bent over it to get all the cock he was craving for. Since both he and I shot three loads each, with literally no breaks in-between, I called a timeout.

"Dude, care for a very late dinner?" I asked.

He looked confused, but the thought of food must have sounded good.

"How are you going to do that?"

I ordered a big meal, and a bottle of wine.

He was pretty fascinated. "Wow, dude I did not know that you can do this.", he said.

Once the waiter knocked on the door, he went to the bathroom, and kept quiet.

A cute, young waiter who rolled the table with all the food in, smiled knowingly, while looking at the bed. I gave him a memorable tip, and made a mental note that this guy, too, looked like someone I would be pretty interested in.

I fucked Georgius again, slow and easy with lots of body contact. He was a strong, tall, muscular dude, and was able to take a lot of heavy pounding, but he, too, welcomed the change of pace.

He fell asleep in my arms, still making out, and smiling.

I fucked him furiously at sunrise, with his feet resting on my shoulders. He admitted that he liked it best that way. By the sound of it, he must have been swearing in Greek like a stevedore, and begging for more in English.

"For a guy who doesn't get fucked this often, I guess, I did pretty well?", he asked.

"Dude, you have been awesome." And I really meant it.

I walked him out after the showers, and hailed and paid his taxi ride back home. I gave him my phone number, and told him to call me if he wanted to meet me again.

I hit the gym, jogged, and spent the rest of my Saturday in bed.

Georgious did not call, and I went looking for my Saturday night hookup in coffee shops of Kolonaki. I nailed a young English exchange student in his digs, and taxied back to my hotel. The guy was unremarkable, but he sure beat a night of solitary exploration in my hotel room.

The events took a strange turn when the guy who opened the branch office door for me Monday morning was this new young office assistant whom they recently hired - Georgius.

KD

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Damn that was HOT!

I never thought about gay baths and professionals - but it makes sense when you are in a tourist area like Athens.

I love the comment "A few guys introduced themselves, at the door, as 'str8 guys' who were going to let me suck their dicks for money. " - like so many posts you see online either from "str8 guys" looking to fuck / get sucked or gay guys who are looking for "str8 guys" to have sex with. It always seems that the gay culture has a fascination with converting the straight guys!

And the bit about your hook-up being the new office assistant... always a bit awkward when you run into someone you had sex with in a non-sexual situation! Acting like nothing happened and both being afraid the other will say something!

Great story - thanks for sharing!

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Being str8 has been the only societally accepted public default in all Eastern Med cultures. Now, being str8 usually also means that you are having sex with other males, too. Because your other, equally str8 friends do, too.

If you are getting your cocked sucked, or if you are fucking another guy, well, the matter at hand is obvious. You are topping, hence you are 'all male'. Who would doubt that? If you end up on the receiving end, there has to be an additional explanation to maintain your 'all male', str8 status. Like, you owed something to the guy who was topping you, and you are paying back. Or you ran out of cash, so this other guy paid you to get some fun. Naturally, you are 'all male and str8' but like all of your buddies, you make exceptions for the 'deserving' guys.

The custom of a bottom dude being given something in exchange for, ehm, his services soon became a pretty universal face saving strategy for a dude who agreed to bottom.

I thought that this MO was kinda silly, but it sure worked. You bought dude a dinner, and since he was short of cash to pay for his part, you fucked the dude. If you ran out of dough, and your buddy bought you a meal, he got to fuck you. A real man always pays his debts, or so the narrative goes.

The foreigners brought a fresh wind into this play, since most of them were not clued in on the local customs. Hence, they were even willing to pay or give away something, and even bttm for you. This made you a double winner, since you got something to trade off for your next sexual encounter.

To quite a few guys, this was only a facade. A dude who enjoyed bottoming got to bottom anyway, because he let one thing lead to another, but it all started with the proper intention of him topping in exchange for something material. So, the pretext was preserved and the dudes with most beads got to play according to their likes.

No one I ever knew questioned the wisdom of this MO. Everybody seemed to see it as perfectly natural.

KD

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Here in the US in my younger days all of us that were fooling around were "straight" we either just "needed to get off" or were "helping a buddy out".

Back then we assumed all gay people acted and sounded like Liberace - who despite claiming to be straight everyone knew...

The rest just acted like "regular guys" until we were alone...




Here, at least in my experience, it was not so much the giving of gifts as the helping a friend out.

Oral was and is the primary activity - with the guys where it went to anal it usually started with trading off - "you fucked me last time so today I get to fuck you". There were a couple of buddies where they had done it but I knew they did not like bottoming so sometimes I would bottom for them with no reciprocation needed. The funny part is they would have to ask - like that made it less gay for me than if I offered.




It was mind games we all played. In our heads we knew it was gay sex - we knew we enjoyed it - but somehow if we were "helping a buddy out" it was not gay it was just getting off.

With the publicity about AIDS anal sex became more and more uncommon. That was no longer just getting off - that was serious.

Now I think that anal has grown in popularity again. Condoms make it safer and medicine means less people are dying from it and it is such a major part of gay porn (I remember old gay porn where they never fucked - the whole video would be oral) - where as the generation growing up early in the days of AIDS were scared off it I think now it is considered "required".

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Yup. This is where our experiences, though coming from different cultures converge. A dude needed to get off, you needed to get off, so you got together and helped each other out.

Every guy out there used to have his group of friends. The guys you would hang out together with. Naturally, a few people mixed with several crowds, and it soon turned out that you and your buddies were not alone in this.

Besides, we have all heard the stories of similar exploits by our elder brothers, uncles, soph students, etc.. The big thing here was that hardly anyone suffered from the 'am I alone in this?' syndrome.

By the time we reached the soph year, we all reached a quiet understanding that having sex with other guys did not make you less straight. It certainly did not make you gay. With so many guys doing it, we all silently agreed that this was kinda 'normal'. Especially, with a few guys who were mentioning that they were going to get married, have children and start families once they graduated, etc.

The stories of our elder brothers, uncles and 'older' friends who did all of the above supported this view. Life was here and then, you were making the best of it, because soon enough, kids, dental bills and mortgage payments were going to be the story of your life anyway.

Very few guys chose to be openly gay. True, we liked to believe that they were all Liberace kind of fems, so no one seriously thought that there was any good in going openly gay. Besides, we were getting pretty much all the sex we needed anyway, so why would you take additional risks and trouble for?




This is the profoundly different bit in our experiences.

First off, oral alone was deemed to be a HS thing, not worthy of college guys. If in a great hurry, oral was fine. 'Dude, we are going to be late for the movies, classes or similar'. So, you went for oral, being your best contingency plan.

Friday night sleepover and oral only? Nope. That would be a waste of your time.

East Med cultures have been highly stratified and not egalitarian for a very long time now. Everyone needed to know his place in the pecking order. Basically, a 'bigger' dude would claim his natural right to top. A better off dude with his own digs would get to set the rules of the game, too. A more popular dude, with a bigger number of friends would also claim his right to top, because he had so 'much' choice, etc.

With the default based on the narrative, 'we are all str8' so we have got to top', both the bottom and the top dudes needed a face-saving strategy that would kinda internally justify a dude's decision to bottom. A new, smaller, inexperienced guy in town needed to make friends. So, he kinda 'owed you'. Hazing as such was virtually unknown, or deemed deviant. But a lonely, young dude with a smaller endowment got to pay his 'entrance' into the established crowd.

None of this was written in stone, and a few bottoms started topping, too. Equally so, a less determined top would agree to bottom for a more 'spectacular' guy who was deemed out of his league, and whom he really wanted badly.

But the 'roles system' functioned pretty well, nonetheless.

If another top dude owed you a favor, he'd introduce you to his bottom friend(s), and it was really up to you to charm him/them into raising their legs up for you.


No doubt that we all knew that the m2m sex we were practicing was a hushed down, if wide-spread affair. Silently, or under the conditions of strict discretion, we all agreed that this WAS gay sex. But hardly anyone would want to say this, or even think about it in those terms. It was a passing thing, enjoyable as it was... And there was really no need to dwell on it too much. It made our lives so much easier, and no one felt a hostage to the dictate of their often demanding and at times, blackmailing girlfriends.

True, the AIDS outbreak sent a few guys running for the hills, and they swore 'the never again' oath. In most cases, this 'never again' lasted for more than several days, until the next party, sleepover, or similar showed up on the horizon. Everyone I knew embraced the condoms, probably because it also reinforced the idea that you were being 'normal'. You would not go bare on your GF either because you would not want to knock her down into an unwanted, premature pregnancy. So, being 'str8' soon entailed the total use of condoms. A few guys also agreed that this helped avoid messy incidents with less, ehm, sophisticated bottom guys.

I'd say that anal sex remains a default. But with so many guys out there hooking up for sex with ease, dudes who are into oral only, frottage only, etc., also have a fair chance of hooking up with someone who is sharing their preferences.

SC

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Yes - the old "boys will be boys" covered a lot of sex play. In many ways I think society views it as guys "can't help themselves" when they get horny they have to do something.

Although sometimes the "everyone is doing it" backfired. I remember a guy trying to get me to fool around and he started saying "Well Bob and Jim both did and they liked it" - and that was what scared me off - that he would be telling everyone what I did!


Here in the US the lines were much less defined. He blew me I blew him. He fucked me, I fucked him. That does not mean it was always a 1 for 1 trade - had a buddy that really did not like being bottom at all - but he did try it - it was just too uncomfortable for him. So at the times he really wanted to fuck I was willing to bottom since I knew it was not that he wasn't willing to - it just was not good for him.





That was very much the same for us - it was never talked about until the next time we were ready to do it. There were no signs of affection except during sex - we were not boyfriends - we were sex buddies.

And it sure did make life easier - I don't see how I could have gone through my teenage years with just jacking off!

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Nope. No one went on telling on other dudes, unless you had all played together, so the talk was legit. But we did a lot of introductions. After you got to know a new dude, and fooled around with him, you would introduce him (with his and their approval, naturally) to your best, most trusted buddies, who, you knew would like the guy. Still, there was no talk of sex. This was totally clear, and implied, but no one addressed the issue. So, the dudes exchanged their phone numbers or not, and maybe met later on (or not). Since it was perfectly clear that you had messed around with the dude, if your buddy scored, he would dutifully report. And, you would to, if the intro came thru him. This was an 'all honors system' but if the dudes noticed that you were a leech, pretty soon, you got isolated.

Basically, everyone differentiated firmly between the media kind of gossip: this celebrity is gay, blah, blah, though there was really no one to verify this, and the info exchange that was going on within a closely knit community.

We also differentiated very strictly between the parties we threw for the 'guys only' which really meant, only the dudes who were part of the deal were welcome; and general 'birthday' kind of parties, where everyone kept their cool, and acted pretty str8.

Soon enough, there were two birthday parties, two Christmas parties, etc.


This would have never worked with our narrative. We were all str8, and we all wanted to fuck. A few guys decided to 'help their buddies out', so they always bottomed which was a bit less desirable, in terms of the narrative, but still pretty much OK. A 'small' dude would have otherwise been ostracized. This way, he got to play, too. A new kid in town who needed leads, housing, possibly a job, sometimes a meal... well, he was just paying off his debts. A dude who needed (or pretended to need) help with his term paper. A new dude, who wanted to get invited to all the swell parties and meet the other guys.

Naturally, we all knew that this was a farce. It was only too obvious that your core bttm buddies (1-2) per top typically, really enjoyed bottoming. Nonetheless, the top guy went to some length treating them well. You'd buy them a dinner now and then. You'd take them along on a road trip, made sure that they did not lack any basic need, etc. The facade was nothing short of a face saving strategy, and was also reinforcing the idea that the tops were eventually going to go str8, and treat their females in a similar way. Sure, this was only a play, and some tops never went for the str8 lifestyle, but the narrative was largely intact.


Amen. There was not talk about any love or emotions, whatsoever. Dudes exchanged the usual love talk while the action was in progress, but everyone knew that this was simply there to enhance the sexual pleasure.

The huge upside of this whole cultural model of behavior was that the campus rape was practically unknown. GF or no GF around, you had your best buddies (and sometimes, some of their buddies, too) to take care of the business at hand. Sure, you were as horny as the next guy, but hardly anyone was desperate or getting insane.

True, the whole setup was heavily tilted in favor of the traditional top/bttm roles. The guys who were only into oral, frottage, etc., ended up on the margins of our underground arrangements. But, to some extent, they too, found their place in this jigsaw puzzle.

I was introduced to a cute, curly hair, lanky dude in his early 20's by a common friend, who warned me in advance, that this guy was not totally one of us. When I inquired about the details, before meeting him, my bud told me that this guy was only giving hand jobs. Not much, but he was pretty much around, and if you needed him, he would show up at a pretty short notice, too.

I thought that this was a bit far-fetched but the info I had received was on the spot.

If you were tardy with your planning, and if your buddies were not available on that proverbial rainy Tuesday night, 'the ambulance dude', (that's how we nicknamed him) was your last, best chance to get some help in getting your rocks off.

He practiced total discretion, and never talked about his exploits. But he would show up, and give you a helping hand if needed. He was surprisingly good, and no doubt, pretty popular, too.

Being probably a bit more generous than an average student jock dude, I'd give him a drink or two, asked him if he wanted a sandwich, or if the public transport stopped (or slowed down) if he needed cash for a taxi ride back home. Though, I met him only half a dozen times, he always pointed out that he appreciated my generosity, and would drop whatever he was doing to come and help me out

KD

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We never talked about it until it was time to do it again. It was like talking would make it real. I knew when my buddy said "you want to go out to the hay loft?" it was time for sex because every time we went there we had sex. But he would never say "want to go have sex?" And in most cases we would not talk about other guys we fooled around with if it was someone you both knew. We understood that if Bob wanted Tim to know he sucked cock it was up to Bob to t him know - not me. You could talk about unknown guys "this guy I met at camp I think he tried to suck off everyone there" - but that was not "outing" anyone.



We were also all "straight" and most guys had a limit as to how far they could go and still be "straight".

Many guys would jack off in front of each other. Remember this was before the Internet and if you had a good magazine or even better a VHS tape you would show it to your buddy and often end up jerking off together. That was fairly common and no one made a big deal about it.

Some guys would be willing to jack each other off - but that was still "straight".

Then a smaller group would eventually move on to sucking each other - but since said we wished there were girls willing to do it - that made it so we were still "straight".

Far fewer were willing to fuck - but since they were the top - they could still consider themselves "straight"

And then the smallest group of all - those willing to bottom. And I think a lot of the reason so few were into it was there is very little way to convince yourself that you are "straight" if you are getting fucked.

And the lines these guys were willing to cross changed back and forth. Maybe for a summer they are willing to trade blowjobs - but by the fall they have a girlfriend and now they will still jack off - but that is it. Or maybe once they are willing to get fucked - but the next time you fool around they make it clear - they don't do that - just oral.

So much of it was mind games - and not even so much to save face with our friends - but for ourselves. After all - we were just horny - we weren't "homos".

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The same here. We never talked about how my buddy and I were going to meet Friday after classes, and have sex. Absolutely not. It was like,

'Dude, wanna come over to my place Friday afternoon. I got a sixpack cooling in the fridge.'

'Yeah, sure. I'd be glad to. Can I stay overnight if the weather turns nasty rather than wait for the freakin' bus to show up?'

The translation for those in the know was only too clear. It was going to be a sleepover with lots of hot action between the sheets. And the dude was not going anywhere till late Saturday at the earliest. The bttm guy not going to walk str8 for a while anyway

Once the few of us started rolling the ball (from our point of view), there was a natural need to expand the mating pool. Some guys dropped out, and went back to the country. One dude or the other would find an understanding GF. One or the other dude thought that this was probably going too far, he did not really like it, etc. So, there has been a natural need to grow, or face a quick decline.

Say, I picked up a guy I knew from seeing at the University Sports Center. He tagged along to see my new digs in the hood, and we hooked up. After a week or a fortnight, I'd ask him if he wanted to meet some of my friends. By this time, he was sure to figure out what was so powerfully cementing the bonds of our friendship. So, he'd say either 'yes' or 'no'.

If he agreed, I'd get in touch with one of my old buddies who had introduced me to some of his 'new' friends lately, and ask him if he was up to meeting a 'new' dude, I met the other day. Again, no one talked sex at all. Naturally, he would be more than happy to oblige. After all, he did not go through the trouble of providing intros to his friends for nothing?

But this is where the tame 'pimping game' stopped. You would usually meet in a popular coffee shop, chat over coffees, and leave the newly established friends/buddies to their devices. From that point on, it was all their business, not mine.



This is where we really had very different experiences.

Sure, we were all 'str8'. That was self-understood. How could it be any other way? Yet, even more importantly, we were the 'players', the cool guys who were having fun, and not the sissies who were afraid of everything and were waiting for their wedding night to lose their respective VCards.

I often thought that being stamped a 'non-player' was much worse than being stamped 'gay'.

Hence, if you were one of the players, well, you had to either play or pack up and go. And the 'play' really meant anal sex by default and few exceptions.

This structure badly needed a good face-saving strategy for a number of confirmed bottoms or an occasional versatile guy. A top guy did not need any explanation whatsoever. He was a str8 horny dude who had no better solution at this time, and went like so many other dudes for the next best. He fucked, which is what men do.

This is where 'helping your bud out', 'repaying old debts', 'trying to get something valuable', etc., came into the story as being the motives for seemingly str8 guys to bottom for other dudes.

Naturally, a born player would not hesitate to get sexual if that meant an invite to the hottest bday party this weekend. Or if someone was going to sort out his term paper, etc..

Hence, the tops pretty much focused on getting all the beads, and the bottoms focused pretty much on collecting the beads in exchange for sexual favors, to use the Mardi Gras terminology.

True. By far, most of it were mind games. But they worked, and our coterie grew to encompass at least two dozens of dudes in its heyday.

Though nothing was written in stone, the roles were pretty set, and the only acceptable change was when a bottom dude started to develop some versatility, since a new wave of clueless 'frogs' came into the town. If he scored as a top with the new guy(s), well that was awesome. The old cohort would keep his past under taps, and the new guys would not be likely to learn that they are now being topped by a former bttm dude.

For those of us in the know, nothing would usually change. Our bttm buddies would still bttm for us, and possibly bring in new guys into play, too.

Occasionally, two tops would team up to tag team a newly arrived bttm dude. As soon as the newcomer left, the two tops would revert to their previous roles, and a good, popular top would get to top a dude who has just topped which added spice to the play.

KD

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I always found it interesting how some guys would "go through phases" where for a period - sometimes it was a one time thing - with others maybe you fooled around all summer - then you meet up with them again down the road and they had - or at least said they had no interest.

One friend who lived next door LOVED it - if anything he was too into it and I would often be telling him to "cool it" or someone would figure out. Then his parents got divorced and they moved away. I saw him the next summer and it was like nothing had ever happened. He was clearly embarrassed to see me and wanted nothing to do with our past activities and pretended they had never happened.

And a few of them "found god" and suddenly they knew it was "wrong" and not only did they stop but everyone else should as well.

And then of course there were the "alcohol gays" - they were totally straight - but if they had to much to drink would be the horniest cocksucker you ever met. I always figured that most of them were just in such denial they needed to be drunk as an "excuse".

I have always believed that everyone is bi to some degree - some are more gay - some are more straight - only society and the rules of society make us feel that fooling around with other guys is "wrong".

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Strange as this may sound, my buddies and I thought that this inconsistent behavior, shifting tastes, finding new groups of people to hang out with, etc., were all 'natural'.

First off, by far, not everyone was really into this kind of play, drunk or not. Second off, life always interfered even with our best laid out plans. So, it was more or less, 'here and now' with a few people. And soon enough, we figured out who was in it for a long haul. So, those dudes became the hard core of the little private coterie which naturally, had its ups and downs, but which, on balance, worked amazingly well until we graduated/post graduated and moved on with our lives.

No one had really expected such clandestine college class DADT arrangements to outlast the college days. And they did not.

But we had a reasonably good to very good times. Sure, a few guys were willing. But you still had to do some footwork to score. You learnt to accept that not every try would always land you a win. And you learnt to shrug with your shoulders, and move on, too. More importantly, most guys understood their positions in the pecking order, and a few learnt to respect their buddies while understanding that no one was irreplaceable, and that a smart guy would never let anyone (male or female) take him by his balls and hold him a hostage.

Some decided to take their experience with them, and the others chose, as you pointed out, to go into the denial. It did not matter to most of us. We paid very little regard to any of this. It got too hot in the kitchen, so a few dudes packed up and left? Yeah, that happens.

A dude left the play? Well, he must have had his reasons. The next dude or a couple of them filled in, and the life kept on moving. Not every 'new' guy was always as good as the guy who chose to move on, but some were, and some were actually a change for the better, too.

KD

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It was always disappointing when a good sex buddy "outgrew" fooling around - but it happened a lot - especially when we were younger. Guys would be so horny they would try anything to get off - but once he started to have other outlets (usually girls) they ended it. But it was frustrating when a buddy with a great ass suddenly said he had a girlfriend now... but most of the guys moved on - only a few were or would accept they were gay.




You had to stay on your toes - young people can change very quickly - but it was frustrating when you were going to see a buddy that had been great in bed and suddenly he acted as if none of it every happened.

Sometimes there might be a comment like "I don't do that any more" other times they acted as if it never happened and you must be crazy.

I may have been crazy but damn there were some fun times!

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I really never took anything for granted. Not even after I have been topping a dude on a very regular basis. Not even when it looked like he was totally gay, and craved cock more than anything else in his life. It is always his life, and he is free to call the shots, move on, come back for more or not.

The good bit about this inherent instability was that practically all my buddies and I counted on it. We networked to no end, and were looking constantly for the 'new' guys, even when it all looked like everything was just fine, and everyone was getting his fair share of fun or more...

Once a dude 'faded away', well, he faded away. A few comments were exchanged among the guys in the know, but that was it. A new dude showed up, and the play continued.

This was a valuable lesson, though. You learnt pretty soon in your young life that sex relationships were very transient. Sure, one or the other dude suffered when his favorite mate gave up on him and moved on to girls or to other guys. But, soon enough, we all learned that this was the default in our college days. It happened to everyone, so no one felt that he was any worse off for the experience than the next guy.

Only one of my buddies came over to me to tell me that it all did not matter, that we were only horny, and that he was a str8 guy looking for girls. The rest of them just faded away.

I did not take an issue with the aforementioned dude. Both he and I knew that I was nailing him for 2 good years, at least once a week, and more often 2-3 times a week.

They say, 'what is done cannot be undone' for a reason...

KD

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In many ways for some guys growing up was sort of like the olden days of men at sea - they did not have any options but could not go for months and months with nothing.

I think a very large percentage at some point in time have SOME sort of MM experience - it may be just jacking off with a buddy - it may go on to full sex - but if everyone where honest (with themselves as well as the survey) I think we would find the number with experience is much greater than people want to admit.

Some stay with it- some do not.




I always found that a bit weird - how the brain and the cock could be so totally out of connection. There were a few guys that were hard and got off and had a great cum - but the "big head" just did not enjoy it. It mostly had to be upbringing because their dick liked it - but somehow they could not get past the idea and they did it once or twice and then it was over.






It is interesting how some were active / willing participants - even instigators - and then deny it ever happened.

But some later on come to accept and get past the guilt - even if they don't want to do it again. I was contacted by a guy I used to fool around with as a teen who found me on the internet. For years he denied anything ever happened. But now he is older and married with kids and seems to have a perspective on it. I never brought it up - but he did - it was very much a thing of the past (he was not looking to hook up now) but perfectly comfortable that we did what we did and enjoyed it.

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Now, I want to college in a major European city. Sure, scoring up with a chick was not as easy, simple and inexpensive as having your buddy give you a BJ. Scoring with a girl meant, dating, romance, time, money. Lots of time and lots of money with no guarantee that a few weeks into the process you may get some. But dating girls was far from impossible. And quite a few guys took that road, too. Some of them looked for their buddies for some little sexual support on the way, and the others stayed faithful to their heterosexual/heteronormative ideals.

I fully concur with John here that most probably, a very large number of guys must have had some sort of m2m sexual experience along the way, while at college. Now, such sexual encounters took place under the condition of total secrecy. No one was going to tell. Hence, I am not surprised that the guys are not mentioning it too often.

I can also imagine that for a number of guys, once or twice off an encounter with another dude that led to nothing in particular, whereas probably interesting, and maybe even satisfying in its time and day stayed what it really was, a once or twice off thing not worth elaborating too much on.





This was probably not just the upbringing but very much so the prevailing societal attitudes of the times. A dude shot his load or two after a hot session. What's there not to like? He may have prefered having some other hardware at play though, but the experience sure beat your usual 'solitary exploration'. At that point, a few guys started thinking that 'one thing usually leads to another'. And a few months later, you are totally hooked up to it, you are enjoying yourself, while the world is about to get ready and reject you totally for being a freak, a homo, a fag, an outcast, whatever. AND you saw your childhood dream of a happy family with kids and the white picket fence just fly out of the window...

Quite a few guys were brought up with an explicit promise of a social contract. You stay with the mainstay, you uphold the majority values, and the majority lifestyle, you shun out the freaks, and the majority will take care of you, and make sure that you'll never have to leave your comfort zone. The golden boys would take care of each other's future. You know, 'Us - The Righteous against them The Freaks'.

The promise was largely maintained in the 40's, 50's 60's and the 70's mostly for strategical reasons. But the '80s brought a landslide change. No one was going to come riding to the rescue of your sorry laid-off, mortgage-ridden, with a bunch of unpaid bills ass just because you were a willing conformist supporting the views of the moral majority.

The social contract deal in its very narrow sense was off. Conformism alone stopped paying bills.

A vast new alternative, and not only marginal world emerged on many fringes of the society, making brave forays into the mainstream.



This is a universal trait of humanity. I had one of my regular buddies tell me that he would have never had sex with me if I had not told him to. Frankly, I am not even sure that I ever formally 'told him' to have sex with me. (How many guys go around formally telling other dudes to have sex with them?) More likely, I pulled out my cock and started stroking it, and he fell down on his knees and started licking/sucking it. When I slapped him on his ass, he bent over for me to ride in.

If he really had asked me if I was telling me to have sex with me, I would have certainly told him to do so

We are all being constantly told that we should be trying to relentlessly promote our own, usually misperceived self-interest first and foremost. Any number of people are buying things that they do not need with the money that they do not have only to go through the interminable agonies of buyer's remorse at the thought that someone else may have clinched an even better a deal over the same item of dubious practical value.

Similar logic applies to some of our past experiences. See, I was nailing this buddy of mine who was just a regular next door college dude. I would have never done so if he had not asked for it, and actually, being the hunk that I was in those days, I could have scored a much hunkier, cooler dude... or at least so goes the narrative. So, actually, none of that pounding, and none of those many shoots had anything to do with me. I only did it because this other guy was willing...

With some dudes, at some point of time, the maturity kicks in, and they see that they should own it, too. They did what they did in their time and day, under the circumstances, and they see that there is no real reason for them to deny it anymore. In particular, now that being gay has become part of the mainstream, too.

KD

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