[biggles69]

Well I think I may have witnessed the death throes of the OLD Sunnee Plaza tonight. Walking past one of the last of the outrageous bars, Good Boys, I was surprised to see it had closed. Surprised as the last time I visited the mamasan boasted how in 5 years it had never been raided because the cops owned half of it.

Well as I struggled to read the handwritten Thai notice on the door, I became aware of an unusally high number of Thai guys in the street - all dressed in black jackets - with Police written on their backs! Continuing to Soi Yen Sabai I realsied the whole area was swarming with black and kakhi clad cops (not the local boys) and the entrance was blocked by 2 large unmarked utes. Clearlry there is finally a political determination to stamp out the underage elements, and the local cops have lost control. Vale Sunnee !

[donatella-t]

There were just doing urine checks. From where my car was parked I copuld see they put about five or six guys and a ladyboy in a pickup or something. They did not even look remotely underage.

[biggles69]

Originally Posted by donatella-t

There were just doing urine checks. From where my car was parked I copuld see they put about five or six guys and a ladyboy in a pickup or something. They did not even look remotely underage.

I read a report today than on 5th Jan 300 Police sealed off Pattaya Soi 6 (where there are dozens of girly bars) ostensibly searching for drugs. They also rounded up a half doz or so unfortunates (inc one lady boy) and whisked them away. Nothing significant was found but the papaer reported this as part of a determined move by BKK to clean up Pattaya and magically transform it from Sin City, to family paradise.

So last night's raid on Sunnee (not 300 but maybe 50 or 60 cops) was part of the same campaign and is designed to send a message - Pattaya's days of drugs, sex and rock 'n roll are numbered.

Personally I doubt a few hundred cops are a match for the hundreds of thousands of tourists pouring in to let their hair down, and thousands of Thai's that are ready to help them.

[firecat]

Going to clean up Pattaya for families is the pinnacle of ridiculous!!!

Does anyone really think Pattaya would exist without SEX.???

Name me one thing it has to offer. Close Walking Street and Soi 6 etc and Pattaya will turn into DUST!!!

[biggles69]

Another one gone ! Wonderland bar closed last night. Last week had about 12 reasonable looking go go guys, but very few customers.

[sloot]

From what I have seen on other online forum boards, the latest campaign, of which the sweep of Sunee was a part, is largely confined to the drug problem. KQuill and some others think that it is even less than that -- just a photo op for a bigwig who wants to score political points being seen doing his job.

It is both unnecessary, and contradicted by first-hand reports, to think that the police are on some sort of campaign to shut down the sex trade. So let's not go overboard with any alarm.

We must beware of two things:

1. Letting our own "guilty conscience" about buying sex (often a product of Judeo-Christian indoctrination) manifest itself in a kneejerk response where the moment someone speaks about police action, we automatically think it is action against sex;

2. Letting those whose interest is directed at partners of borderline or questionable age speak for us. To them, indeed, police action rounding up the underaged -- which happens from time to time -- would represent a "closing down of sex" and reason enough for shrill cries of "the end of all that is Pattaya". But the rest of us should not unthinkingly be sucked into this stream, lending our voices to it and thereby becoming guilty by association.

[biggles69]

Agree this campaign is ostensibly about drugs, but all the reports I've been reading over the past month show total failure to find anything other than a few low level pushers and some positive urine tests.

It is a in all likely-hood a PR campaign which is all about show not substance, with those controlling the trade tipped off well in advance.

There is however a strong PR message about cleaning up the sin city image of Pattaya and that does suggest the sex trade is being targetted by some-one, although I think we all agree they are doing the "King Kanute" thing with no chance of success.

I'm not sure where you are going with your item 2. re underage. I dont think any of the posters here are bemoaning that element of the clean up.

[sloot]

Originally Posted by biggles69

Agree this campaign is ostensibly about drugs, but all the reports I've been reading over the past month show total failure to find anything other than a few low level pushers and some positive urine tests.

It is a in all likely-hood a PR campaign which is all about show not substance, with those controlling the trade tipped off well in advance.

We are on the same page regarding this. It's good that we share the same starting position in our analysis.

Originally Posted by biggles69

There is however a strong PR message about cleaning up the sin city image of Pattaya and that does suggest the sex trade is being targetted by some-one, although I think we all agree they are doing the "King Kanute" thing with no chance of success.

Where is that suggestion ("PR message about cleaning up the sin city image of Pattaya and that does suggest the sex trade is being targetted") coming from? From the authorities' mouths? From the evidence of their actions? It seems to me that it is mainly coming from some farangs who take an unduly broad reading of the facts.

I can concede that the authorities themselves have not taken the trouble to articulate clearly what their objectives are and how narrow those aims are (most probably because it is not politically possible to exclude adult prostitution so explicitly without incurring the ire of foreign NGOs driven by holier-than-thou agenda). In my view, the authorities' silence then allows space to some board posters' alarms that give the impression that adult sex is being targetted. As a result, there can be collateral damage in that potential visitors to Pattaya are then needlessly discouraged, thereby inflicting economic damage to adult sex venues.

All I am saying is: Let's not add to the collateral damage by mindlessly echoing the unfounded fear that adult sex is being targetted.

Originally Posted by biggles69

I'm not sure where you are going with your item 2. re underage. I dont think any of the posters here are bemoaning that element of the clean up.

I'm not suggesting that anyone here is motivated by that element. The key phrase I used was "guilt by association". Echoing fears about a general clampdown on adult sex when there is no general clampdown (but only a clampdown on the underaged trade) risks further confusing the two. So please let's be very careful not to join the wrong protest march -- that was my point.

[icon513]

The only things I see them trying to clean up are drugs and underage sex.

And, in Soi 6, the actual providing of sex services on-site.

What was the problem again?
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[donatella-t]

I think the whole sex trade might be gone maybe a decade from now. If I look back to 10 - 15 years ago and now, there are far fewer bars, far fewer guys, and far, far more Russians. The Russians come for the sun, not the sex. And we can find the boys online. Much cheaper and easier.

[JupiterJake]

I popped into Good Boys very briefly on the weekend. It was all but dead. Virtually empty. I stayed for one drink then left. I'm sure it will be back in one form or another at some juncture.

[biggles69]

I just heard a report on Pattaya radio. It said that following Pattaya's relaxation of licencing closing times, BKK is concerned this will lead to an increase in drug and sex related crimes at the same time as the PM has demanded a 20% reduction in crime.

Tuesday's raid on Sunnee was "organised and directed" by the new Minister for Justice using BKK and local police. (If the locals were involved the "Mr Bigs' will have been tipped off.) Total haul was one illegal fire-arm, a handful of ya-baa tablets and a few under-age sex workers. Hardly justification for the hundreds of poilce apparently brought in.

Apart from that I agree with the recent comments above. Russians are now dominating the beach, while on-line hook ups replacing the bars (no -off fee, no expensive drinks but definitely AYOR.)

[icon513]

There WERE tip-offs, in spite of BKK police being used (according to my sources). That is why so little was found, and the problem continue.

I wish they would start submitting the garage that patronize some of those blatant underage bars to pee and passport checks.
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[firecat]

This constant harping on underage is tiresome. I have been going to Pattaya for 15 years and there are less underage boys in the bars then ever before..

Many of the underage bars are no more . Eros, Sundance, Jimmy Jimmy James etc etc etc are all closed .

I am not going to tell you that Krazy Dragon or Niceboys or My Mic might not have a 16 or 17 year old mixed in. But the bars with 13, 14 ,15 year old are no more and in the Beer Bars finding anyone under 24 would be an achievement.

The bottom line is that thins are dramatically better and anyone who says there not is speaking with out any real knowledge.

And by the way if everyone took the time to examine ID's the last of the underage boys would disappear.

[biggles69]

Originally Posted by firecat

Many of the underage bars are no more . Eros, Sundance, Jimmy Jimmy James etc etc etc are all closed .

Agree 100% (although a bar called Eros is still open but all look legal to me). You can add to the closed list Tom Yum, Euro Boys, Kaos etc.