Hey GUYZ,
I just wanted to share that I got gonorhea from a guy that sucked me off. After going to the doc and getting treated, he said that guyz that are into "oral" only can be the worst ones to carry the disease. The throat is the easiest place for the disease to reside. Just because they do "oral" only and feel that it is "safe" they don't get tested and pass it on.

I got it from a HOT GUY at the gym. It was a HOT scene that started in the shower area and ended up in another location in the gym. It was a slow night and we could get away with it. Well, about 3 days later I got the "drips" and went and got treated. I had to send an email to the guyz that I was in contact with since the gym incident and tell them to get tested and treated.

I AM NOT A SEX NAZI!

GET TESTED and GET TREATED if you are sexually active!

your thoughts.........

Quote |

Thanks for the reminder

__________________
Cute white guy, into uncut guys.

Quote |

Thanks for the heads up...Yeah..I think of oral as being pretty safe. Thanks for the reminder!

Quote |

Nope, you are not a sex nazi or whatever.

You had a bit of unprotected fun and this time it did not quite work out the way it mostly does. We all know that shit happens to all of us.

Now, you did two good things in my books, that is. You got treated and you alerted other guys, so that they could go and have the bug checked and treated, too.

I already know a few guys (some str8, some gay) who came up with the same basic story. They did not think oral was dangerous, etc. Now, they have stepped into it and it feels like...

All of us want/ought to read your post. You want to make a qualified and educated decision for yourself. Do you want to take such risks or would you rather have a condom over your dick and minimize your risks?

Youd shot guys...

KD

Quote |

What's the point? Might as well go sightseeing with a blindofld on. Swim in a three piece suit.

So you get the clap. You take one pill and it's gone. Life is to be experienced. Bad things sometimes happen. Not the end of the world.

Quote |

I just went to the doctor because the head of my cock has been itching like crazy. The doc told me that chylmadia is also very easy to get from cocksuckers and that a person can be a carrier for quite a while before symptoms show up in the recipient of the blow job. What an eye opener! Although the STD tests came back negative, I guess I'll wear a condom next time I get sucked.

__________________
Always looking for a JO buddy

Quote |

What's the point? Might as well go sightseeing with a blindofld on. Swim in a three piece suit.

So you get the clap. You take one pill and it's gone. Life is to be experienced. Bad things sometimes happen. Not the end of the world.

What's the point??? Let me be your seeing-eye catt on this one Yogiman.

The point is to be careful for yours and others health sake. Not all STD's are cured by "one pill" and not everyone has the same reactions to either the disease or the cure. AND not all STD's are curable. Too many people have died due to either ignorance or being aloof to the fact that they can fall prey to disease.

Sure bad things sometimes happen, but anyone with half a brain cell would know enough to try to avoid the bad so that the experience of life is better.

I won't deny the fact that there are a large number of posters to these threads that openly engage in risky behavior and that is their choice albeit a bad one. Perhaps they are indeed sightseeing with a blindfold on.

But to just think "Who cares if I have a disease that I can spread to others... I'm gonna have my fun anyhow." - that's an indication of premeditated stupidity.

Quote |

I am amazed at the replies I am getting to my "alert" or "warning".

I posted it to this site due to the possibility of visitors that view the messages and tips on where to meet to let them know that, if they are bi-sexual or gay with a partner, and enjoy what they feel is "safe sex" THEY STILL NEED TO GET TESTED! As one reply stated, the symptoms can hide and not be caught till its too late. If these same fellas "go home to the girlfriend or wife" or "boyfriend/partner" and conduct a normal, albeit, straight/safe sexual performance, SHE/HE is at risk for coming down with something!

JUST THINK OF WHAT THAT DISCUSSION WOULD BE LIKE!

I had to have the same type of conversation with my boyfriend after I spread it to him. IT'S NOT A FUN CONVERSATION! We BOTH had to go get treated!

I posted this as a warning to all that think they are "playing safe". "SAFE PLAY" is NOT what it was 5 or 10 years ago! TIMES HAVE CHANGED! If you are suckin cock in restrooms, gyms, car garages, alleys, theatres and sex clubs and won't go any farther with the sex play (i.e. anal, swallowing cum) to avoid coming down with something, YOU ARE NOT OUT OF THE WOODS! YOU still could be spreading it around.

TAKE CARE OF YOURSELVES, GUYZ! Go get tested (some places its annonymous) get treated and lets try to curb the infection rate. Maybe we can all get back to the regular, good ol oral sex that we all seem to LOVE on this site!

Quote |

This is not true. Nothing has changed in the last ten years. AIDS was with us in 1994, and every other STD has been with us FOREVER.

I wanted to avoid this thread, but I think it's worth a few comments now.

I have STRONGLY disagreed with Yogi about other issues, yet this time around, I see his point. While I am not nearly as blasé and jolly about the subject of STDs as he seems to be, there is no reason to get in an uproar over a case of the clap.

The original post was intended as a caring and considerate reminder and it was thoughtful of someone to share his story so that we all can give some additional thought to something we may push out of our minds far too often. Nothing wrong with that. This is why I didn't respond -- there was nothing to say. Good advice, just let it be.

Yet there is no need to sit around and fret or get overly paranoid. While it IS true that the clap and syphilis are sometimes symptomless, it is pretty rare, at least in the United States, for these STDs to go unnoticed for long. ABSOLUTELY we can spread these diseases around -- and we do. They are on the rise as of late. That's not good news. By the same token, SOMETHING preventable is on the rise every freaking year. Are we going to become terrified to live our lives because of it, are are we going to keep a level head and not succumb to EITHER reckless and wanton behavior OR crippling paranoia?

Once again, I make my case for a HAPPY MEDIUM.

HIV is DEADLY. There is no cure. It is symptomless for MANY years. You can spread it to others by being a fool. It is entirely preventable. Most other STDs can be taken care of, show symptoms much more often, and generally speaking, do NOT kill you (at least not as a sure thing, as HIV does).

So this is where MOST of us seem to draw the line. "Safer sex" as a means of preventing and (hopefully) someday stopping the spread of HIV, a deadly disease. Most of us will not give up other forms of sex, things which are PROVEN to be safer.

KD won't let a guy suck him or vice versa without a condom. This is HIS choice. It doesn't mean he lives in fear -- he's simply made his own assessment of what level of risk he is willing to take. He's acted on this and stands firm. That's admirable. I respect that decision -- but it is not acceptable for ME.

Yep, I'm at risk for orally transmitted STDs -- and that's a risk I am well aware of. If I put on a condom on my dick to get sucked, I'd never get sucked. I'd feel nothing, I wouldn't get hard, and I'd end up with no sex life at all. I may as well live in a monastery and get it done with. This is MY personal choice, my acceptable level of risk. It's up to the guys who want to suck my dick to decide for themselves what THEY want.

AIDS is different. I refuse to have it on my conscience that I could contract or spread a fatal disease by behaving foolishly. Doing so would put other human beings at risk for death. I won't do it. I draw the line at unsafe sexual practices that have a high risk of HIV transmission. And to be very honest here -- I think the vast majority of men out there share my choice. Gay sex may not be necessary for the procreation of the species, but as MEN, we are biologically driven to have sex. Give it up completely? No... it ain't gonna happen.

I agree -- the clap and syphilis are often TOO lightly discussed. They are often used as television jokes. In this day and age, they've become funny in light of the fact that there's this virus out there that is SO much more deadly. Let's be totally honest now... if any of us had a choice, we'd EASILY pick a curable and treatable STD over AIDS, wouldn't we?

One thing not mentioned here which bugged me -- the statement from a doctor that men who do "oral only" are more likely to spread the clap. I am dubious about this. Hasn't this doctor considered that men who engage in even MORE dangerous behavior are just as likely to spread the clap? In fact, men with HIV who still suck dick are MUCH more likely to have ANOTHER STD -- or a wide variety of contagious infections. Men who fuck almost always also SUCK and get sucked as a prelude to anal intercourse, and sometimes instead of it if they can't get it. HIV puts us at a higher risk of contracting and spreading OTHER STDs. I think this doc isn't looking at the whole picture here. Fuck me for disagreeing with a doc -- but I do.

The matter of explaining these types of situations to your partner, wife or girlfriend -- well, that's another topic entirely. You screw around, you take the risks, you'd better be prepared to face the consequences. I have no pity for anyone having to go through this situation, except maybe the unsuspecting partner (no offense to one of my buds out there -- but he already knows this and it doesn't mean I don't like him).

Just use a little common sense, guys. Have a bit of decency toward your partner. If you're cheating, ask yourself WHY and deal with it.

Don't be reckless, don't be a fool -- but don't be a hermit and live your life in fear, existing on Prozac or Paxil to keep you calm.

THINK before you act. Weigh your options, educate yourself, be aware of the risks and stick to your guns regarding your own personal level of risk.

If I spend my life eating McDonald's Quarter Pounders for lunch every single day, I'm not going to have much success warning anyone else when I find out my cholesterol level is higher than Cheech Marin circa 1967. Anyone with half a brain (maybe less) already knows this.

Gentle reminders, a sharing of a story -- that's totally cool. Freaking out is not.

Quote |

Thanks to Blondbuzzed for staying on his course. He has had a bad experience and is sharing it here with us, hoping that we might be more alert to the risks involved. Lots of people read these boards and lots of guys have been alerted. Good Work!

The same goes to Straycatt and Samgone. Way to go!

If anyone thinks that you sometimes 'freaked out a bit' and that this 'aint a biggie' and 'what the hell, shit happens anyway', la, la, la, reconfirm their right to think so. (We live in a free country, don't we?) It is your health, your well-being and last but not least, your medical bill at stake here. (Dr. Danny claimed in one of his postings that he had bought his first house solely on gonohrea. Ain't this telling?) You are very qualified to feel about it the way you do! Eventually, yours is the right to err on the side of safety as much as it is theirs to err on the side of risk. I feel very cool about being able to say, dude, I care when shit happens in your life. The other guys are very free to say that no shit in other people's lives is big enough for them to admit that they care. That's how I see 'cool' and that's how they see 'cool'.

I do very gladly agree with Scruffy that 'nothing has changed in the last 10 years in terms of the safe sex.' What has changed is our perception of what is 'safe', conditionally speaking and what is 'risky', conditionally speaking, too.

Some 10 years ago, safe sex was largely defined in terms of 'make sure, you wear a condom, if you are an anal top and conversely, make sure your top wears a condom, if you are an anal bottom. Do not share the same tooth-brush and beware of using the same needles and syringes, if you are an intravenous drug user'. Such policies failed to stop AIDS completely but certainly helped towards reducing the numbers of new seroconversions. Life for many of us, avid cruisers, started returning to normalcy and few sex clubs (if not spas) (re-) opened up in San Francisco, too. Lots of folks moved (back) to the city in the early to mid-1990s; myself, included. Yes, we were having a ball of a kind, too. The party, if on a reduced scale, went on.

Towards the end of the 1990s a significant upsurge in new cases of chalmydia, syph, clap, Hep B and C, etc. has been reported by the SF health authorities. AIDS was still big in our eyes but a host of other, mostly curable STDs virtually had a party of their own, too. In 2000, AIDS activists started giving away small key-chains with a flash light and detailed instruction how to inspect a penis for tell-tale signs before taking it into your mouth. I would have found that humorous, if I did not know better.

Europeans have been always more cautious when describing the risks of oral sex and various groups and organizations in Germany started recommending wearing protection even when having oral sex only, early in the day. I have never come across any report on the upsurge of STD infections here (am in Europe at the moment) and certainly no one was distributing those little flash lights.

There is a growing tendency to include 'oral sex with condom' recommendation into the general guidelines and definitions of safe sex. (I am not saying that anyone had done so, so far, but I see a trend there.)

My bottomline:

The decision to use condoms with any kind of sex is always an individual decision, no matter how harsh the consequences might be, for both yourself and the others.

You might wish to reconsider your present sexual practices and re-estimate your risk levels. Living in a committed, monogamous relationship is very different from cruising the PowerExchange or the Steamworks, five times a week and partying on the buffet of seemingly endless debauchery. Or having few, tame regular buddies who come to service you on a regular basis, for that matter.

I happen to have a very 'active' sexual life. I also happen to be a keen observer and have no problem in chatting up the guys, if I want to. So, I met this 'absolutely gorgeous, A&F, All-American, and what not 'college dude, couple a weeks ago in SF. He hits one of the sex clubs 2-4 times a week, and starts early in the evening. Very few guys turn his blow job offer down and he is GOOD! He says his personal record was to suck 44-45 cocks in one night. He said, he lost the precise count. His goal is to reach 60 for one night and, yeah, if the guy shoots, he swallows. If the guy wears a condom, he'll suck him, too. After all, a cock is a cock is a cock... rite? I am wondering, what is his health status after having trained for this kind of sexual Olympics over the last six months? I guess, Dr. Danny could buy half-a-villa in Italy and stuff the fridge full of food for his growing nephew, just trying to cure this one single dude. (K, I am kiddin'!)

There is no final answer to this. Your truth and your decision will always be yours and only yours to live with. If this gave you some food for thought, we have all done a very good job here.

KD

Quote |

From an article in the Southern Voice
I see no reason why this statistic would be restricted to HIV only. There is other good information in the article that I hadn't seen before as well; it's worth reading.

My guess is that glory holes, especially in ABSes, would also rank high in disease transmission rates because of the anonymity. Has anybody seen any studies on this?

Quote |

So guys, play safe. Cruise parks, not bathhouses. Or at least do that when you are in LA.

Better yet, if it's written in The Southern Voice, ignore it altogether.

Not one of my favorite papers.

Oh, and Samgone: chlamydia doesn't itch. It burns and causes a relatively clear drip, unlike gonorrhea. Yeast will itch. You can get both/either from oral sex. If your itch hasn't cleared, get back to your doctor!

Dr Danny

Quote |

It's all about BEHAVIOR. HIV is a preventable disease. We seem to forget that.

If you go to a bathhouse and do NOT engage in unsafe sex, do NOT compromise your own standards... there's probably very, very little concern regarding your choice of cruising venue.

Problem is... the atmosphere of security (little chance of being busted) and the abundance of possible partners sometimes elicits alternate behavior in some of the weaker-willed men out there.

It's much easier to get fucked in a bathhouse than it is in a public park. Hell, there's even shower stalls where you can rinse off the lube...

It makes sense to figure that men who SEEK OUT and UTILIZE this atmosphere might possibly be higher risk partners. But if we REFUSE to engage in unsafe sex when offered -- it's very likely there's little to worry about, at least as far as getting HIV is concerned. Our risk for OTHER STDs certainly goes up, since HIV positive men are more likely to be infected with something else, too.

The thing is... men who go to bathhouses also cruise the parks, the streets, the bars, the internet... No matter WHERE you are, there's no telling who has what. It could be a mistake to instill a false sense of security that one place is safer than another. What's safer and what is not is STILL the sexual act in question.

I've seen a lot of scary shit in my day... most notably scenes involving lines of men ready to fuck a willing bottom, gang-bang style (sling optional). While we can easily (or even with some effort) walk away from such reckless behavior, how do we know for sure that the guy we meet a week from now hasn't gleefully taken up residence in that sling for hours on end at some point? We don't... We might meet this guy in a public place, maybe online, maybe in a bar. He may not want to tell us of his occasional romps in the sling. We may express safer sex concerns to him and he could easily pretend to agree, if he wants to get us in bed badly enough.

So it's still up to each of us to play it safe and do the right thing, no matter where we are and no matter who we are with.

Quote |

Thanks, Dr. Danny. I would have never thought of a yeast infection, primarily because I thought it could be gotten from a female.

The itch is gone, although I ended up taking the medication (to cure the STDS) before I found out the STD tests were negative.

__________________
Always looking for a JO buddy

Quote |

Gents, life is aleatoric, i.e. a crapshoot; nothing's guaranteed. Here is how the numbers work out on catching an STD.

You take the probability that your potential partner has a particular STD, multiply that by the probability that it will be transmitted to you in the sex act you contemplate and multiply that by the harm that can occur to you if you catch that STD (very high for HIV, low for getting a hickey from a blowjob). Now sum that formula over all potential STDs and don't forget to include some factor for unknown diseases. After all, HIV was not known until 1984 and who knows what else lurks out there waiting to escape from some obscure Asian or African mammal into the human population? That is your "expected harm" from any single encounter and you can try to make a judgement about whether the risk exceeds the reward. Obviously, the more encounters you have the higher your total expected harm becomes.

This is pretty abstract but think of it in terms of playing Russian Roulette. The number of encounters you have is analogous to the number of times you pull the trigger. The ratio of the number of bullets to cylinders in the revolver is analogous to the probability of an infected partner times the probability of transmission. I suppose that harm could be modeled by playing RR and pointing the gun at various body parts, not just your head.

Now I am not proposing that cruisers carry pocket calculators around with them to calculate the odds but there is an important lesson to be learned by looking at the formula. Your expected harm can be reduced in a number of ways, by not pulling the trigger, by removing bullets from the cylinders and by not pointing the gun at your head. All are equally effective (but estimating the probability of transmission is surer than estimating the probability of an infected partner). If you want to be really safe you do all three. So I think that avoiding statistical populations of infected people is a reasonable part of a sexual hygiene program.

Based on several postings on CFS and reports of a local syphilis epidemic being traced to a single bathhouse I was not surprised to read the results presented in the Southern Voice article and thought that others might benefit. In my effort to reduce my expected harm I am always interested in learning more information about where the risks are. Any time anyone has epidemiological information please feel free to post the link.

Quote |