BKK is f**ked. Twilight Bars just chasing $$$ and Solid has changed hands (nr nature Boy). Only suggestion is to try Super A round the corner & 1st floor. Hit and miss but some ready and willing twinks. Sapan Kwai dead, lack of western gay tourists and growth of Internet dating is killing other host bars.

Other suggestion is come to Pattaya. Funny boys is how Fresh Beach boys used to be (minus show) lots of sexy smooth twinks, and there are a half dozen other bars in Boystown worth a visit.

Hotels and drinks all cheaper here.

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-- Agreed in general, but with some reservations:
1. - DONGTAN BEACH is now LESS fun and gay-friendly and MORE commercialised than it used to be - even looking-back no farther than the past couple of years;
2. - PATTAYA is becoming LESS clean: beaches MORE polluted, LESS cleaning of streets and of surrounding areas - too much trash & garbage strewn around promiscuously;
3. - In several bars there are too many, too obviously seeming under-age young men - AYOR.;
4. - But in BOYZTOWN I've found that both FUNNY BOYS, (always.), and HAPPYPLACE, (usually.), worth visiting - the latter especially so on their 22nd. of every month 'Bingo.' evenings!
5. - I prefer EROS A GO-GO BAR to HAPPY BAR A GO-GO.; the boys are maturer but are still young men and mostly 'Ready, Willing & Able.'!
--

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What are you talking about? There's loads of fun that can be had in Bangkok on a daily basis! I wouldn't overrate the decline of go-go bars, as there are plenty of alternatives. Commercial and non-commercial ones, that is.

And there's certainly no lack of Western gay tourists in Bangkok! Go to DJ station or Babylon on any given day. Browse the "Travelers" list on GayRomeo... etc. etc.

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QUOTE=BKK-European;685130]
... .
And there's certainly no lack of Western gay tourists in Bangkok! Go to DJ station or Babylon on any given day. Browse the "Travelers" list on GayRomeo... etc. etc.[/quote]

-- But, as a Westerner, (for example), why spend hundreds of USD. and fly thousands of miles to BKK. to pick-up or to be picked-up by other Westerners?
--

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Hey guys.... happy to see the spirited discussions going on here!

So the scene in Manhattan is way different from here in Bangkok, as I am sure everyone knows. My preference is a network of semi-clandestine clubs where one can pursue the pleasures of the flesh with other like-minded gentlemen. The "commercial" scene (a la BKK) is internet-heavy and bar/club-light. (Having said that, a beer costs no more than $3US/100THB.

I am in Pattaya right now, and either it has changed or I have. A bit underwhelmed and really just hanging out with some familiar faces. The one most obvious change is that it has become home to large groups of Russians. I never enjoyed the company of my fellow Americans while traveling but, in comparison, I am finding USA'ers well-behaved (!!)

To the original topic: I will sample the Super A/Nature Boy area once the places re-open following today's holiday. Thanks for the suggestion. Really sad that Saphan Kwai is no longer the place to go. I enjoyed those venues. Tried hitting Babylon over the last weekend but ended up spending most of my time in the gym. Amazing: what time do you have to get there to stake out one of those pool-side chairs???? By 1pm they were all populated with towels. (And not to be IN ANY WAY age-ist, BUT: I am FAR from young, but I did lower the average age of the place considerably...)

In any event: it is good no matter what to be here. And I appreciate your messages!

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That's not the point I was trying to make, my dear Khun Sextile, I didn't want to suggest that Westerners coming to Bangkok should pick up other Westerners while being here. Some are doing that, of course, but you're right that they could do that elsewhere and wouldn't need to travel to Bangkok.

Part of Khun Biggles' argument of why "Bangkok is f'ed" was that there's a lack of Western gay tourists in Bangkok. I guess what he wanted to say is that Bangkok has lost its appeal to Western gay tourists, so they are staying away. To which I replied that I don't have that impression, there are plenty of them.

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$3 for a beer with nothing to look at but other customers? Doesn't sound like much of a bargain to me. Might as well drink a $1 beer on the curb outside a 7-11...

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[/i]

-- Khun BKK-European,
- Thanks for yr. clarification - appreciated.
- I know that it's bad logic to argue from the particular to the general, but while SILOM SHOPPING COMPLEX PLAZA was OPEN during the C'mas. Season I wasn't the only farang to comment on the apparent lack of other & visiting farangs - our Thai acquaintances said so, too.
- I know of several Americans who no longer visit 'Mossland Life.', citing expensive air-fares and generally higher costs once arrived.
- There may be other reasons, such as CAMBODIA opening-up and becoming MORE gay-friendly, as just one example?
--

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Cambodia is a long way from being "gay friendly".

It is night and day in comparison with Thailand, in regards to attitudes.

You can count the number of "gay" venues in Cambodia on one hand.

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You might well be right with your observation regarding Silom Shopping Complex, Khun Sextile, but keep in mind that many new shopping malls have been built all over Bangkok. Toilet cruising aside, I suppose, Silom Shopping Complex couldn't really compete with most of these. Many of my Western gay friends still frequent Silom's and Sathorn's gay venues like the ones I've mentioned, but for shopping, they are quite literally all over town nowadays.

I'm not convinced that the overall number of Western gay tourists coming to Bangkok is in decline, but I agree that it's hard to know and it can be misleading to try to generalize from friends' reports.

What I'm quite sure about and what has been discussed many times, however, is that their cruising and dating behavior has been changing significantly within just a couple of years.

When I moved to Bangkok some six years ago, and before when I had still been a visitor myself, most fellow farang on GayRomeo were young-ish expats and visitors. Now you see guys of all ages looking for online hook-ups, including some mature friends of mine from my lovely home country.

So I do understand the decline seen in go-go bars and similar places, as many visitors chat with Thai guys before they even come to Thailand and make private arrangements to meet them, without using a bar to facilitate it.

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I'm pretty certain that for my next visit to Thailand (last was in 1986), I'll be visiting for the food and the culture and not the go go boys, Western or local.

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back to the subject:
Sapan kwai is not dead-but slowly, slowly diminishing. There are 5-6 of those karaOKThai-style bars left in that ''gaysoi'' and 1 goog-beHigh. Just as it always has been.
Those DJ-Thai style disco's wont apperal to single older farang-for 99% of them > the only glorious reports from that come from visitors who shared their black label bottles with groups of friends and, I guess, were too drunk to note. These are in Ram-uni, Ratchda and OToKo (a little beyond Sapan kwai). IF you like thunderous noisy music, Thai-style table dancing and not cruising-go with groups to amuse yourself. Again that gayscout listing (going out) lists them. Even though maps on google are not 100% coorect-they will lead you to nearby-and then open mouth and ask.
What has grown in BKk are the m2m massageshops-all over town, some 40+ now. Some ex barboys staff them, mostly part-time students or those who cannot stand the gogo as ''work'' themselves. But no off-its only service (or outcall in some).

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A brief update!

So I visited the Silom Soi 6(?) area last night, and went to Nature Boy, choosing it only because I had been there before and knew the scene.

There were 8 boys working and I was the only customer. They did the usual thing of all converging on me, which I really do not like. (I prefer to be the one who makes the selection.) Two of the guys I entertained during my last visit (nearly two years ago!) remembered me well.

Quite honestly, although there was perhaps one guy I would have off'ed, I found the atmosphere so oppressive that I just wanted to finish my beer quickly and get out. Unfortunate. Had I been more comfortable, it could have been a good evening.

Any experience or suggestion on how to deal with THAT scene there?

More to come.

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Easy. Just tell the ones you want to sit with to stay, and the rest to go away!

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Amen to that. Cambodia is light years from LOS Check out my posting in the other area of CFS...

Why not just slip a 20 baht note and discretely say you just want to talk to these two.... They'll understand, and have the chance to get the next guy when he comes in... Thats what I do'. Got to have supply of 20's in your back pocket though... I;ve done that at NB's and Super A although I think I used 100's at Super A because the large group had been putting on quite a show...

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