When you cruise in public places (bookstores, parks, bathrooms, rest stops...ANYWHERE PUBLIC) I'm sure we all can agree that it's pretty much anonymous encounters, sure you might hit it off with someone and more comes out of it but reality says that hardly happens (at least with me).

Anyways I was just wondering, actually always have wondered. When you cruise places like this, should you tell people if you have a STD or are HIV positive or should the potential people you might hook up with already have an understanding that anyone they are hooking up with could have 'something' and what they are doing is ATOR?

Exactly how different is this type of cruising for sex method different from say cruising on the internet where chat is a must before ANYTHING ever even happens sexually? And while were on the subject of online meetings, what do you think about online meetings as well? Are online hookups just as anonymous as public cruising hookups or should you tell if you have 'something'?

I'm not dumb, I know what the right thing to do in all of these situations are BUT lets be honest, most people are not going to just give this information out to just anyone, especially some random trick, you just don't know who you can trust anymore.

I was just curious what you guys thought was the 'general rule' regarding these questions I have asked or if it really is AYOR behavior? Does it make the person who does have 'something' a horrible, evil person for not telling the other(s) (no matter how they are meeting them)? or is this type of behavior just exceptable and just learn to accept and deal with the risks of 'anonymous sex'.

Thanks.

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This is one of the reasons I never cruise. If I had something there is no way I would allow myself to possibly infect others, that's just so incredibly irresponsible. However I realize there are many irresponsible people out there.

Having said that I do trust people that I might meet from the internet that they are indeed std and hiv free. That may be naive I realize people can be just as irresponsible in that manner. However I do think that when someone goes through the trouble of setting up a meet and allows you to come to their home that they have a more vested interest in being honest than just someone in a booth or elsewhere.

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Do NOT trust online hookups as having any more veracity than "anonymous" hookups in cruise venues. Guys online LIE and OMIT ALL the time.

I cannot begin to tell you the HUGE number of dudes I have seen CHANGE their online profiles when they realize that their honesty about their HIV status is limiting their sexual partners. Dudes will list "HIV poz" for a few weeks, get no sex (assuming), then remove this bit of information and cruise aggressively.

I have a photographic memory -- I NEVER forget a profile or a photo. But others are not so lucky. I have gone so far as to tell a dude that I know he has removed his HIV status from his profile.

I once went to a dude's house and after having ASKED him if he was "disease-free," he told me upon arrival that he was NOT. He could have saved me the gas money, but he lied online, only to feel guilty when I got there and provide a confession.

But to answer your question:

You are quite correct: assume NOTHING in ANY situation.

Cruising and ALL sex, gay or straight, is AT YOUR OWN RISK.

YOU and ONLY YOU are responsible for protecting yourself.

The optimist in me likes to think that MOST guys would be honest, but I also believe most guys are going to be honest only if ASKED.

The bottom line is you can NEVER know for sure and must take care of yourself.

Online cruising is no different from any other sort of cruising. And it is as varied as "regular" cruising, too. Some online hookups happen in a matter of minutes -- others take many days of "get to know you" conversation. Doesn't matter either way -- honesty is at the discretion of the individual.

Do not forget: STDs do not discriminate. They are equally distributed between HONEST guys and SCUMBAGS.

Many STDs show no visible symptoms, so just looking at someone when cruising is no guarantee of safety. However, rather obviously, any dude who shoves a festering, sore-covered cock through a gloryhole is not likely to get many willing mouths to take it in!

And, of course -- many people who are infected with a symptomless STD don't even KNOW it.

Which is why it is imperative that YOU watch out for yourself.

Use a condom, avoid contact with semen and mucous membranes.

Finally, I think it is perfectly acceptable to ASK anyone anything you want and to ask in ANY circumstance: online or in a bookstore or whatever. Sometimes this is a mood-killer, but... these are the times we live in now.

I think ASKING may often result in an honest response, but you can never be certain of that. It won't HURT to ask, but you must exercise caution at all times nonetheless.

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I don't know all the regs, but I have been told that if an HIV+ person does not divulge his status to you and engages in unsafe sex with you, he has just committed a felony. The HIV+ guys I talk with say that alone is enought to keep some guys honest who otherwise wouldn't be. But they told me that other guys stopped getting tested when the laws were passed. So the effect of the law was to drive sexually active men away from early detection.

Anonymous tricks being spontaneous, I would think the latest time would be when the cock is presented or spit is going to be swapped. Any time earlier than that would depend on the interaction.

If you engage a guy online and his profile doesn't disclose his HIV status, then you need to ask. He can lie, but it can come back to haunt him if he does lie. There are guys right now facing attempted murder charges because they did not disclose their HIV status to their partners.

I had a guy wait until we both were naked before he asked me. I assumed up to that point he might be HIV+ and acted accordingly. You should do the same. After disclosure we still both practiced safer sex. (no sex is totally safe-unless it is masturbation alone lol)

And here's some food for thought: guys are only as clean as their last partner, not their last test. So even if you ask and he is honest as to his known status, he could still have been the pig bottom guest of honor at the 50-man gang fuck the month before.

I think the best thing is to think with your big head, not your little head. Take precautions with your health and be fully aware of the exact level of risk of STD's of each act you engage in.

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I have a really simple answer to this,YES.
It would be stupid and irresponsible to not do so .

__________________
Check out my profile (website) for more fun
~

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So? If it's anonymous sex how you going to ID the guy so he can be charged with a felony? It sounds like a law with no teeth.

I think guys cruising online lie a lot more than guys cruising face to face.

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The laws have been used to prosecute HIV+ men who have knowingly had unsafe sex and not divulged their status.

I don't know the details of all the cases. I just have read news clips at Advocate.com. Each time, the defendant's HIV+ status was a matter of record, and multiple partners reported being unaware of his status before engaging in sex with the defendant.

Anonymous encounters don't lend themselves to prosecution unless the guy's cruising behavior has been caught on security videos, etc.

If a HIV+ guy is picked up by police in a known cruising area and charged with a sex-related crime, that opens the door to further investigation as to his conduct sexually.

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B1orim,

If you are the one with the STD I find it extremely depressing that you felt the need to ask this question.

Let me ask a hypothetical question:

If you were walking across a busy street, didn't look carefully before starting and missed seeing a car bearing down on you at high speed, would you want the driver to:

a) slow down and avoid you, or

b) assume that you really wanted to commit suicide, speed up and aim for you?

If you were the driver instead what would you do?

Bottom line: you have a moral obligation to always disclose any condition that could affect the other person so that person can make an informed decision. However, 'evil people' will not be much motivated by moral obligations.

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I see no harm in asking, as such. Yet, in all honesty, when it comes to the casual ONS, anonymous sex, etc., I cannot see quite very much good coming out of it either.

Quite a few guys simply do not know because they do not undergo testing at regular intervals and the truth is that you are 'basically as healthy as your last partner' unless you opted for 'safer sex'. So many do not know and many more are not in the position to really know the truthful answer to your questions.

Scruffy was right to point out that Poz dudes mostly tend to hide their status. The reasons are obvious. Indeed, there is a legal aspect to it, but when it comes to those quick ONS, encounters in the backrooms and ABSes and baths of this world, the actual practicalities of legal proceedings make the prosecution a matter of very low probability.

And, I must disagree that guys who are asked, would always divulge the truth and nothing but the truth, for the fear that this may come later on to haunt them... A lot of guys simply do not care and could not care less. Many of them reason that you happen to be an adult and that you ought to be aware of the risks your actions may contain. So, if you do not want to accept those risks, do not play the game.

So, I never bother to ask and I always, always use protection. In Europe, very, very few guys who would otherwise mess around with me, zip up and leave, once they realize that condom is a must and not an optional. In California, anywhere between 40-50% of guys just zip up and leave, cause they want it bare.

At times, this is admittedly, very discouraging. But the very thought of the consequences that may follow, even, if it is only that syph thing which is fully curable and possibly thus, rampant in San Francisco at the moment, make me cringe and stick with my 'safer sex' policies.

Just my 2 cents, guys...

KD

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All cruising, whether it be online or offline, is always AYOR because anonymous 'hookups' for sex often entail the omission of a person's health status such as HIV and other STD's.

Legally, a person can be criminally charged with reckless endangerment of another person's life if they fail to disclose their HIV Positive status AND have unprotected sex with that person. Criminal intent to endanger another person's life is implicit in omitting one's HIV positive health status AND having unprotected sex with another person. The legal obligation to inform is often ignored when cruising for anonymous sex, whether it be initiated online or at some other cruising venue offline.

Morally? It is reprehensible to endanger another person's life by omitting a person's HIV positive health status and having unprotected sex with another person.

Ethically? Our personal ethic is to do no harm to another person. Omitting one's HIV positive status AND having unprotected sex is behavior which endangers another person's life. It also dishonors the value of another person's life.

There are legal, moral and ethical consequences for failing to inform and having unprotected sex.

__________________
Those who deny freedom to others deserve it not for themselves. And, under a just God, cannot long retain it.

-- Abraham Lincoln

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Like BMG just stated, there's no argument to justify putting another person in harms way.

That said, it still doesn't take the burden of responsibility off of us to orchestrate our own risk management when it comes to cruising for sex. While we'd like to think everyone is honest and forth coming with information that we need to make decisions, that's hardly the case, no matter what venue in life we're talking about. So, we need to act accordingly and make decisions for ourselves that will have consequences, good or bad, that we're comfortable with, or at least we "think" we're comfortable with. Sometimes we regret decisions thinking a consequence is not as big a deal as it turns out to be. Examples range from, "This guy is really hot, seems clean so I'm willing to risk getting the clap and let him suck me off", then that case of the clap comes and it entails painful urination, medical expenses and sometimes a difficult conversation with a partner. Or, "This guy said he's bi and only tops so I'll let him fuck me raw", only to find out he took a load himeslf the weekend before while induced with substances and doesn't remember, hence again, leading to an even higher consequence of HIV infection.

The thing is most guys don't know they are carrying an STD or HIV. The window for HIV infection is vast and the only assurance a person can give you is "My last test was negative". Nobody can say they're negative for sure unless they've been abstinent for a good six months, test negative and you get them into bed before they have their next sexual encounter.

The other STD's also have a window, albiet a much shorter one. A guy could suck you off on Sunday that seems really clean cut and all that good stuff, but you don't know that he's been on a crystal meth binge all weekend and has sucked off about thirty cocks in two days and has contracted a few nasty STD's with no symptoms yet. Especially if he's a bottom where guys can carry the big "G" in their throat with no symptoms at all ever.

So, I guess what I'm saying is to adhere to the theme here in this thread: Play at your own risk.

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When I addressed the legal consequences of failing to inform a sexual partner of a known health hazard, such as HIV or another STD, I didn't adequately address the practical aspects of failing to inform a sexual partner which deal with our moral and ethical obligations to one another.

I don't believe the vast majority of men cruising for sex anonymously intend to recklessly endanger the lives of other persons by consciously failing to inform their sex partner(s) of their HIV positive status or some other sexually transmitted disease such as Syphillis, Herpes, etc., if diagnosed and being treated. The assumption here is that once diagnosed and while undergoing some treatment program or regimen, an individual would not engage in unprotected sex with other people where transmission of the disease is likely to occur. However, the practical aspect of this is very troubling and problematic.

Anonymous "hookups" are exactly that -- neither sex partner knows each other, and they certainly don't know each other's health history. This is why anonymous 'hookups" are always At Your Own Risk (AYOR). So, if you have anonymous men engaging in unprotected sex, there is a risk of disease transmission which is multiplied by the number of sex partners an individual may engage in unprotected sex. What is particularly problematic here, from a practical point of view, is that a significant number of men engage in unprotected sex and have never been tested for HIV or any other STD unless symptoms appear and the individual's health fails or is otherwise compromised in some significant way. Another aspect that is equally troubling and problematic is men engage in sex more frquently than they get tested for HIV -- if they do at all.

Getting tested for HIV and receiving a negative result from that test provides a false sense of security if a person's sexual lifestyle is anything but secure and protected. We know, for example, that some males are using Crystal Meth as a Party and Play (PnP) 'recreational drug' to enhance their sexual experience. While using Crystal Meth, an individual may experience episodes of lost memory where their inhibitions are remarkably lowered and may engage in unprotected sex with multiple sex partners.

While I don't believe a vast majority of men intend to recklessly endanger the lives of others, the practical aspects of their sexual histories and lifestyle suggest many might be in denial about their health risks or minimize the degree of their risk by a false sense of security or the trust they have in an anonymous sex partner(s). Ultimately, this begs a question that each of us must answer with sobriety and honesty:

Why do Gay and Bisexual males place too much trust in people with anonymous sexual health histories when their lives and health are at stake?

__________________
Those who deny freedom to others deserve it not for themselves. And, under a just God, cannot long retain it.

-- Abraham Lincoln

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